You're going to get a lot of terse replies because this gets asked on the first day of GAC. Pretty often it also gets asked on the first day of the second round, too.

Every GAC pod has either 8 or 5 players. They make as few 5-player pods as possible, but unless the number of players who sign up in a given division are exactly divisible by 8 there are going to be some. In those 5-player pods, one person per round is going to get a bye at the start of the round. They get points as if they'd full cleared all four sections on the first try.

You're not dumb, since you came and asked what was up instead of automatically assuming folks were cheating, that's what normally happens with these threads. Thanks for not being aggro! Now, if you want to help out, copy this someplace and next time the thread pops up, paste it. Pay it forward!

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

But by doing the math that would mean a bye round gives you the 1600 for the win, 1243 for full clear (64 per character team and 72 for the fleet, plus conquer points), and the additional 730 for setting defenses. That would add up to 3573 total, and if you add in the 'Win fleet battle with no reinforcements' feat that would be the additional 70 points needed to get to 3643.

So while possible to get this number, I find it weird that a bye would award you points for defenses, offenses, and the win. I could understand just the 1600 for the win, but if you aren't setting defenses or fighting on offense why should you get those points too? I've never been in a bye round so I'm not sure how the points work. I just think it's too big of a boost if they give you every point possible that you could have earned.

You're going to get a lot of terse replies because this gets asked on the first day of GAC. Pretty often it also gets asked on the first day of the second round, too.

Every GAC pod has either 8 or 5 players. They make as few 5-player pods as possible, but unless the number of players who sign up in a given division are exactly divisible by 8 there are going to be some. In those 5-player pods, one person per round is going to get a bye at the start of the round. They get points as if they'd full cleared all four sections on the first try.

You're not dumb, since you came and asked what was up instead of automatically assuming folks were cheating, that's what normally happens with these threads. Thanks for not being aggro! Now, if you want to help out, copy this someplace and next time the thread pops up, paste it. Pay it forward!

Thank you for the explanation.. i have been playing since GAC came out.. I never get a 5-player pod. I want free points! lol

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

That's an awful lot of luck rolling it almost every chance, I think they said it's very hard to get multiple byes.

So while possible to get this number, I find it weird that a bye would award you points for defenses, offenses, and the win. I could understand just the 1600 for the win, but if you aren't setting defenses or fighting on offense why should you get those points too? I've never been in a bye round so I'm not sure how the points work. I just think it's too big of a boost if they give you every point possible that you could have earned.

Maybe. But it also compensates a little for having a two day stretch where you can't advance feats. On certain rounds it might even mean some feats are impossible, since they have a 2 day time limit and require you to do something in a Grand Arena battle.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

You think 180,000 lifetime score is low? Considering the top of my arena has between 200k - 220k and I'm sitting at 191k, I think that's a decent score.
They were in div 3, this will be their first div 2 GAC but with they're roster I cant see how they could take teams.
I'm fully aware people get byes, But getting them over and over doesn't seem fair if that's the case.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

You think 180,000 lifetime score is low? Considering the top of my arena has between 200k - 220k and I'm sitting at 191k, I think that's a decent score.
They were in div 3, this will be their first div 2 GAC but with they're roster I cant see how they could take teams.
I'm fully aware people get byes, But getting them over and over doesn't seem fair if that's the case.

It’s lower than 80% of the leaderboard for div2, so yeah I think it’s low.

And there’s only one person in this thread suggesting that this player has had multiple byes. I don’t see any reason to make this claim.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

You think 180,000 lifetime score is low? Considering the top of my arena has between 200k - 220k and I'm sitting at 191k, I think that's a decent score.
They were in div 3, this will be their first div 2 GAC but with they're roster I cant see how they could take teams.
I'm fully aware people get byes, But getting them over and over doesn't seem fair if that's the case.

It’s lower than 80% of the leaderboard for div2, so yeah I think it’s low.

And there’s only one person in this thread suggesting that this player has had multiple byes. I don’t see any reason to make this claim.

You're getting that number from where? (Honest question).
Just looking at their roster it just seems weird to me to that didn't have help from multiple byes. That's why I question it. I'm sure they would have been banned long ago if it wasn't legit.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

You think 180,000 lifetime score is low? Considering the top of my arena has between 200k - 220k and I'm sitting at 191k, I think that's a decent score.
They were in div 3, this will be their first div 2 GAC but with they're roster I cant see how they could take teams.
I'm fully aware people get byes, But getting them over and over doesn't seem fair if that's the case.

It’s lower than 80% of the leaderboard for div2, so yeah I think it’s low.

And there’s only one person in this thread suggesting that this player has had multiple byes. I don’t see any reason to make this claim.

You're getting that number from where? (Honest question).
Just looking at their roster it just seems weird to me to that didn't have help from multiple byes. That's why I question it. I'm sure they would have been banned long ago if it wasn't legit.

I counted the div2 top 50 which had 40 people with a score that was higher. (I won’t insult you by explaining further!)

Remember that matching is based on top X GP. Someone with inflated GP but an altogether weak roster will have faced others in the same boat. This guy might be pretty decent fighting with what he’s got.

So while possible to get this number, I find it weird that a bye would award you points for defenses, offenses, and the win. I could understand just the 1600 for the win, but if you aren't setting defenses or fighting on offense why should you get those points too?

It's the game (matchmaking) that robbed you of the opportunity to set your defenses and play your offense. Why on earth should this be such a major disadvantage to you? You're not at fault.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

And also check previous comments by Kyno that matchmaking also takes place during the preview phase and not all at the end which he used to argue that a leave/rejoin feature wouldn't be possible to implement.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

Do you have a way to view the matchmaking GP for each group member at the time their individual rosters were locked?

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

And also check previous comments by Kyno that matchmaking also takes place during the preview phase and not all at the end which he used to argue that a leave/rejoin feature wouldn't be possible to implement.

If I recall correctly, he said matchmaking starts at roster lock. One could consider snapshotting the player's roster and calculating MM GP from that locked roster to be a start but that is not the same thing as actually creating brackets.

You cannot build the actual brackets progressively during the 24 hour signup window because you would be left with a lot of unmatchable players in the later stages because their good matches would already be in brackets. Either they would have to rework a lot of already created brackets (with cascading effects) at the end of matchmaking or they would create a lot of undersized brackets and we would see a lot more byes on the scoreboards.

It simply does not make sense to build the actual brackets until the signup window is closed and simplest way to get good brackets is to walk a sorted list from highest GP to lowest making sets of 8. You can always subdivide the data set into subsets wig some multiple of 8 members and walk them in parallel to speed things up.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

Do you have a way to view the matchmaking GP for each group member at the time their individual rosters were locked?

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

And also check previous comments by Kyno that matchmaking also takes place during the preview phase and not all at the end which he used to argue that a leave/rejoin feature wouldn't be possible to implement.

If I recall correctly, he said matchmaking starts at roster lock. One could consider snapshotting the player's roster and calculating MM GP from that locked roster to be a start but that is not the same thing as actually creating brackets.

You cannot build the actual brackets progressively during the 24 hour signup window because you would be left with a lot of unmatchable players in the later stages because their good matches would already be in brackets. Either they would have to rework a lot of already created brackets (with cascading effects) at the end of matchmaking or they would create a lot of undersized brackets and we would see a lot more byes on the scoreboards.

It simply does not make sense to build the actual brackets until the signup window is closed and simplest way to get good brackets is to walk a sorted list from highest GP to lowest making sets of 8. You can always subdivide the data set into subsets wig some multiple of 8 members and walk them in parallel to speed things up.

There are ways of doing this. With your theory of first sorting all who joined and then splitting them in groups of 8 from top to bottom after preview ended you assume that the aim is to match players as closely as possible on relevant GP. Are you sure this is the case? If it is how would you match the extreme top relevant GP players? Wouldn't they be matched against several of the same opponents again and again until a new character is released?

How about if they instead operate with intervals of acceptable difference within a group of 8? A sort of brackets within every league? Then they could form most groups of 8 during the preview phase and have much less processing to do during those couple of minutes between preview and setup in round 1.

You and I don't know how they do it. We can only guess. The fact remains that Kyno said that some of the matchmaking takes place during the preview phase (/ at roster lock) and that this is part of the reason that a leave/rejoin feature can't be added. If sorting is the only thing that happens during preview I don't see why it would prevent this leave/rejoin feature. For this reason I doubt that sorting by relevant GP is the only part of matchmaking that takes place during preview.

I looked at his roster too, since I'm in D2. He only has 7 g12 and no g13 characters. That doesn't strike me as a D2 roster. I know he can get the gp by stretching his roster out wide and not focusing any teams though, and no judgement there.

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

Most likely each division+league is sorted by matchmaking GP and split into brackets of 8 from top to bottom. In that setup, the weakest 1-7 players in each league+division would have a chance of getting a bye.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

And you know this how?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

And also check previous comments by Kyno that matchmaking also takes place during the preview phase and not all at the end which he used to argue that a leave/rejoin feature wouldn't be possible to implement.

This is actually useful to manipulate the matchmaking system.

## Replies

Every GAC pod has either 8 or 5 players. They make as few 5-player pods as possible, but unless the number of players who sign up in a given division are exactly divisible by 8 there are going to be some. In those 5-player pods, one person per round is going to get a bye at the start of the round. They get points as if they'd full cleared all four sections on the first try.

You're not dumb, since you came and asked what was up instead of automatically assuming folks were cheating, that's what normally happens with these threads. Thanks for not being aggro! Now, if you want to help out, copy this someplace and next time the thread pops up, paste it. Pay it forward!

But by doing the math that would mean a bye round gives you the 1600 for the win, 1243 for full clear (64 per character team and 72 for the fleet, plus conquer points), and the additional 730 for setting defenses. That would add up to 3573 total, and if you add in the 'Win fleet battle with no reinforcements' feat that would be the additional 70 points needed to get to 3643.

So while possible to get this number, I find it weird that a bye would award you points for defenses, offenses, and the win. I could understand just the 1600 for the win, but if you aren't setting defenses or fighting on offense why should you get those points too? I've never been in a bye round so I'm not sure how the points work. I just think it's too big of a boost if they give you every point possible that you could have earned.

Thank you for the explanation.. i have been playing since GAC came out.. I never get a 5-player pod. I want free points! lol

Dont forget their single zeta, his fastest toon is 230 Shaak ti, missing a mod and also a 1 dot mod on her. I can't understand how they have 180k lifetime score. It seems fishy to me, but hey weirder things have happened.

That's an awful lot of luck rolling it almost every chance, I think they said it's very hard to get multiple byes.

Maybe. But it also compensates a little for having a two day stretch where you can't advance feats. On certain rounds it might even mean some feats are impossible, since they have a 2 day time limit and require you to do something in a Grand Arena battle.

What’s the relevance of this? Lots of people in the top 50 of div2 have a lower lifetime score. Perhaps this player was in div3 or even div4 earlier?

People get byes. There is nothing “fishy” about it.

You think 180,000 lifetime score is low? Considering the top of my arena has between 200k - 220k and I'm sitting at 191k, I think that's a decent score.

They were in div 3, this will be their first div 2 GAC but with they're roster I cant see how they could take teams.

I'm fully aware people get byes, But getting them over and over doesn't seem fair if that's the case.

And there’s only one person in this thread suggesting that this player has had multiple byes. I don’t see any reason to make this claim.

Just looking at their roster it just seems weird to me to that didn't have help from multiple byes. That's why I question it. I'm sure they would have been banned long ago if it wasn't legit.

Remember that matching is based on top X GP. Someone with inflated GP but an altogether weak roster will have faced others in the same boat. This guy might be pretty decent fighting with what he’s got.

Anyway, as you say, time to move on.

It's the game (matchmaking) that robbed you of the opportunity to set your defenses and play your offense. Why on earth should this be such a major disadvantage to you? You're not at fault.

You're not split into groups of 8 from top to bottom - not even in the first GA of a Championship.

How is matchmaking performed?

Yes. Check your group of 8.

And also check previous comments by Kyno that matchmaking also takes place during the preview phase and not all at the end which he used to argue that a leave/rejoin feature wouldn't be possible to implement.

If I recall correctly, he said matchmaking starts at roster lock. One could consider snapshotting the player's roster and calculating MM GP from that locked roster to be a start but that is not the same thing as actually creating brackets.

You cannot build the actual brackets progressively during the 24 hour signup window because you would be left with a lot of unmatchable players in the later stages because their good matches would already be in brackets. Either they would have to rework a lot of already created brackets (with cascading effects) at the end of matchmaking or they would create a lot of undersized brackets and we would see a lot more byes on the scoreboards.

It simply does not make sense to build the actual brackets until the signup window is closed and simplest way to get good brackets is to walk a sorted list from highest GP to lowest making sets of 8. You can always subdivide the data set into subsets wig some multiple of 8 members and walk them in parallel to speed things up.

There are ways of doing this. With your theory of first sorting all who joined and then splitting them in groups of 8 from top to bottom after preview ended you assume that the aim is to match players as closely as possible on relevant GP. Are you sure this is the case? If it is how would you match the extreme top relevant GP players? Wouldn't they be matched against several of the same opponents again and again until a new character is released?

How about if they instead operate with intervals of acceptable difference within a group of 8? A sort of brackets within every league? Then they could form most groups of 8 during the preview phase and have much less processing to do during those couple of minutes between preview and setup in round 1.

You and I don't know how they do it. We can only guess. The fact remains that Kyno said that some of the matchmaking takes place during the preview phase (/ at roster lock) and that this is part of the reason that a leave/rejoin feature can't be added. If sorting is the only thing that happens during preview I don't see why it would prevent this leave/rejoin feature. For this reason I doubt that sorting by relevant GP is the only part of matchmaking that takes place during preview.

This is actually useful to manipulate the matchmaking system.

Thanks