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Forge & Fabric difference

winnetrie

By winnetrie
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winnetrie Diamond Finder

winnetrie

Posted
Posted

Hi, all.

This post is not about criticizing or demand anything. Please do not be offended, i merely trying to understand things why and how.

 

So i saw on Reddit the Fabric team bragging having released their Fabric modloader 2 minutes after mc 1.16 released.

I wonder how can they do that so fast and forge not? Is Forge much more complicated? Do the Forge devs have no time/money/resources?

Is fabric being sponsored? What's holding up the Forge team? Is there anything we can help?

What's the difference between Fabric & Forge?

Try out my new Modpack for MC  1.15.2

https://www.curseforge.com/minecraft/modpacks/terran-civilization

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DavidM World Shaper

DavidM

Posted
Posted (edited)

I haven't used Fabric before, but from what I've heard:

Forge uses an event driven system. Fabric (IIRC) treats all mods as coremods (mixins).

This makes Fabric significantly more lightweight than Forge,  and therefore quicker to develop and update. I wouldn't be surprised if a Forge update's workload is more than 10 times the workload of a Fabric update.

However, since Fabric mods use mixins, it is very easy to cause incompatibilities between mods (think of Forge coremods), while Forge's event system can theoretically supports infinite amount of mods.

 

Apart from that, Forge has a much bigger user base than Fabric, therefore the Forge team has to respond to more PRs and issues. I imagine this to be very time consuming.

Edited by DavidM
  • Like 1

Some tips:

Spoiler

Modder Support:

Spoiler

1. Do not follow tutorials on YouTube, especially TechnoVision (previously called Loremaster) and HarryTalks, due to their promotion of bad practice and usage of outdated code.

2. Always post your code.

3. Never copy and paste code. You won't learn anything from doing that.

4. 

Quote

Programming via Eclipse's hotfixes will get you nowhere

5. Learn to use your IDE, especially the debugger.

6.

Quote

The "picture that's worth 1000 words" only works if there's an obvious problem or a freehand red circle around it.

Support & Bug Reports:

Spoiler

1. Read the EAQ before asking for help. Remember to provide the appropriate log(s).

2. Versions below 1.11 are no longer supported due to their age. Update to a modern version of Minecraft to receive support.

 

 

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DaemonUmbra Reality Controller

DaemonUmbra

Posted
Posted

Fabric is INCREDIBLY lightweight, they provide the loader and a minimal API, this allows them to be quite agile but by the same token modders must make heavy use of Mixins (coremods) to write their own hooks into the Minecraft code, which is typically not good for stability if done poorly or when many are combined in a single modpack.

 

Forge on the other hand is a bit of a fat bastard but comes with a ton of utilities and hooks set up with the goal of providing everything a modder needs so they never need to directly modifiy the Minecraft code, essentially Forge tries to do the ugly so modders never have to.

This is my Forum Signature, I am currently attempting to transform it into a small guide for fixing easier issues using spoiler blocks to keep things tidy.

 

As the most common issue I feel I should put this outside the main bulk:

The only official source for Forge is https://files.minecraftforge.net, and the only site I trust for getting mods is CurseForge.

If you use any site other than these, please take a look at the StopModReposts project and install their browser extension, I would also advise running a virus scan.

 

For players asking for assistance with Forge please expand the spoiler below and read the appropriate section(s) in its/their entirety.

Spoiler

Logs (Most issues require logs to diagnose):

Spoiler

Please post logs using one of the following sites (Thank you Lumber Wizard for the list):

https://gist.github.com/: 100MB Requires member (Free)

https://pastebin.com/: 512KB as guest, 10MB as Pro ($$$)

https://hastebin.com/: 400KB

Do NOT use sites like Mediafire, Dropbox, OneDrive, Google Drive, or a site that has a countdown before offering downloads.

 

What to provide:

...for Crashes and Runtime issues:

Minecraft 1.14.4 and newer:

Post debug.log

Older versions:

Please update...

 

...for Installer Issues:

Post your installer log, found in the same place you ran the installer

This log will be called either installer.log or named the same as the installer but with .log on the end

Note for Windows users:

Windows hides file extensions by default so the installer may appear without the .jar extension then when the .log is added the log will appear with the .jar extension

 

Where to get it:

Mojang Launcher: When using the Mojang launcher debug.log is found in .minecraft\logs.

 

Curse/Overwolf: If you are using the Curse Launcher, their configurations break Forge's log settings, fortunately there is an easier workaround than I originally thought, this works even with Curse's installation of the Minecraft launcher as long as it is not launched THROUGH Twitch:

Spoiler
  1. Make sure you have the correct version of Forge installed (some packs are heavily dependent on one specific build of Forge)
  2. Make a launcher profile targeting this version of Forge.
  3. Set the launcher profile's GameDir property to the pack's instance folder (not the instances folder, the folder that has the pack's name on it).
  4. Now launch the pack through that profile and follow the "Mojang Launcher" instructions above.

Video:

Spoiler

 

 

 

or alternately, 

 

Fallback ("No logs are generated"):

If you don't see logs generated in the usual place, provide the launcher_log.txt from .minecraft

 

Server Not Starting:

Spoiler

If your server does not start or a command window appears and immediately goes away, run the jar manually and provide the output.

 

Reporting Illegal/Inappropriate Adfocus Ads:

Spoiler

Get a screenshot of the URL bar or copy/paste the whole URL into a thread on the General Discussion board with a description of the Ad.

Lex will need the Ad ID contained in that URL to report it to Adfocus' support team.

 

Posting your mod as a GitHub Repo:

Spoiler

When you have an issue with your mod the most helpful thing you can do when asking for help is to provide your code to those helping you. The most convenient way to do this is via GitHub or another source control hub.

When setting up a GitHub Repo it might seem easy to just upload everything, however this method has the potential for mistakes that could lead to trouble later on, it is recommended to use a Git client or to get comfortable with the Git command line. The following instructions will use the Git Command Line and as such they assume you already have it installed and that you have created a repository.

 

  1. Open a command prompt (CMD, Powershell, Terminal, etc).
  2. Navigate to the folder you extracted Forge’s MDK to (the one that had all the licenses in).
  3. Run the following commands:
    1. git init
    2. git remote add origin [Your Repository's URL]
      • In the case of GitHub it should look like: https://GitHub.com/[Your Username]/[Repo Name].git
    3. git fetch
    4. git checkout --track origin/master
    5. git stage *
    6. git commit -m "[Your commit message]"
    7. git push
  4. Navigate to GitHub and you should now see most of the files.
    • note that it is intentional that some are not synced with GitHub and this is done with the (hidden) .gitignore file that Forge’s MDK has provided (hence the strictness on which folder git init is run from)
  5. Now you can share your GitHub link with those who you are asking for help.

[Workaround line, please ignore]

 

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LexManos Reality Controller

LexManos

Posted
Posted

This has been asked and answered many many times...

Our mod launcher was updated to 1.16 about 18 months before it even came out. Considering our mod launcher doesn't care what you target. It works for any java application doesn't even have to be Minecraft.

 

As for MCP, it took about 35 seconds for the RC1->Release process to run.

About about 55 mins for the unit tests to run and make sure things wouldn't break for end users.

1.16->1.16.1 again took about 30 seconds, with another 55 mins of testing and making sure shit won't break.

I could slap something together that "works" and release it. I could, but i won't.

It's a matter of scope, and quality.

 

 

  • Like 1

I do Forge for free, however the servers to run it arn't free, so anything is appreciated.
Patreon: http://www.patreon.com/lexmanos
Paypal: http://paypal.me/LexManos

BitCoin: 1Q8rWvUNMM2T1ZfDaFeeYQyVXtYoeT6tTn

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DaemonUmbra Reality Controller

DaemonUmbra

Posted
Posted

There's definitely drama between small groups in Forge and Fabric, some of Fabric's fans have been anti-Forge since before Fabric was a thing and now they have a non-Forge loader to hide behind.

I haven't personally seen their Forge counterparts, but Fabric's Discord moderators have assured me they exist.

This is my Forum Signature, I am currently attempting to transform it into a small guide for fixing easier issues using spoiler blocks to keep things tidy.

 

As the most common issue I feel I should put this outside the main bulk:

The only official source for Forge is https://files.minecraftforge.net, and the only site I trust for getting mods is CurseForge.

If you use any site other than these, please take a look at the StopModReposts project and install their browser extension, I would also advise running a virus scan.

 

For players asking for assistance with Forge please expand the spoiler below and read the appropriate section(s) in its/their entirety.

Spoiler

Logs (Most issues require logs to diagnose):

Spoiler

Please post logs using one of the following sites (Thank you Lumber Wizard for the list):

https://gist.github.com/: 100MB Requires member (Free)

https://pastebin.com/: 512KB as guest, 10MB as Pro ($$$)

https://hastebin.com/: 400KB

Do NOT use sites like Mediafire, Dropbox, OneDrive, Google Drive, or a site that has a countdown before offering downloads.

 

What to provide:

...for Crashes and Runtime issues:

Minecraft 1.14.4 and newer:

Post debug.log

Older versions:

Please update...

 

...for Installer Issues:

Post your installer log, found in the same place you ran the installer

This log will be called either installer.log or named the same as the installer but with .log on the end

Note for Windows users:

Windows hides file extensions by default so the installer may appear without the .jar extension then when the .log is added the log will appear with the .jar extension

 

Where to get it:

Mojang Launcher: When using the Mojang launcher debug.log is found in .minecraft\logs.

 

Curse/Overwolf: If you are using the Curse Launcher, their configurations break Forge's log settings, fortunately there is an easier workaround than I originally thought, this works even with Curse's installation of the Minecraft launcher as long as it is not launched THROUGH Twitch:

Spoiler
  1. Make sure you have the correct version of Forge installed (some packs are heavily dependent on one specific build of Forge)
  2. Make a launcher profile targeting this version of Forge.
  3. Set the launcher profile's GameDir property to the pack's instance folder (not the instances folder, the folder that has the pack's name on it).
  4. Now launch the pack through that profile and follow the "Mojang Launcher" instructions above.

Video:

Spoiler

 

 

 

or alternately, 

 

Fallback ("No logs are generated"):

If you don't see logs generated in the usual place, provide the launcher_log.txt from .minecraft

 

Server Not Starting:

Spoiler

If your server does not start or a command window appears and immediately goes away, run the jar manually and provide the output.

 

Reporting Illegal/Inappropriate Adfocus Ads:

Spoiler

Get a screenshot of the URL bar or copy/paste the whole URL into a thread on the General Discussion board with a description of the Ad.

Lex will need the Ad ID contained in that URL to report it to Adfocus' support team.

 

Posting your mod as a GitHub Repo:

Spoiler

When you have an issue with your mod the most helpful thing you can do when asking for help is to provide your code to those helping you. The most convenient way to do this is via GitHub or another source control hub.

When setting up a GitHub Repo it might seem easy to just upload everything, however this method has the potential for mistakes that could lead to trouble later on, it is recommended to use a Git client or to get comfortable with the Git command line. The following instructions will use the Git Command Line and as such they assume you already have it installed and that you have created a repository.

 

  1. Open a command prompt (CMD, Powershell, Terminal, etc).
  2. Navigate to the folder you extracted Forge’s MDK to (the one that had all the licenses in).
  3. Run the following commands:
    1. git init
    2. git remote add origin [Your Repository's URL]
      • In the case of GitHub it should look like: https://GitHub.com/[Your Username]/[Repo Name].git
    3. git fetch
    4. git checkout --track origin/master
    5. git stage *
    6. git commit -m "[Your commit message]"
    7. git push
  4. Navigate to GitHub and you should now see most of the files.
    • note that it is intentional that some are not synced with GitHub and this is done with the (hidden) .gitignore file that Forge’s MDK has provided (hence the strictness on which folder git init is run from)
  5. Now you can share your GitHub link with those who you are asking for help.

[Workaround line, please ignore]

 

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DavidM World Shaper

DavidM

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 6/25/2020 at 11:08 PM, winnetrie said:

On fabric they say : forge is old and laggy. Fabric is new and shiny.

If someone benchmarks a clean Forge install and a Fabric install, then the performance might be a tiny bit (not even noticeable) better on Fabric's side due to its lightweight.

However such result is not conclusive, as Forge does a lot more (event system, utils, etc) than Fabric. Try benchmarking both API with 100+ mods and Forge API will manifest its advantage.

Judging APIs solely for its performance is like comparing Tetris to a first person shooter game. "Hey Tetris uses up less RAM and CPU so it is much better than the FPS game!"

 

But yeah, people might prefer Fabric if all they want is to add a simple tweak/mod to the game. At the end of the day, it is really up to the user and his/her use case.

Edited by DavidM
  • Like 1

Some tips:

Spoiler

Modder Support:

Spoiler

1. Do not follow tutorials on YouTube, especially TechnoVision (previously called Loremaster) and HarryTalks, due to their promotion of bad practice and usage of outdated code.

2. Always post your code.

3. Never copy and paste code. You won't learn anything from doing that.

4. 

Quote

Programming via Eclipse's hotfixes will get you nowhere

5. Learn to use your IDE, especially the debugger.

6.

Quote

The "picture that's worth 1000 words" only works if there's an obvious problem or a freehand red circle around it.

Support & Bug Reports:

Spoiler

1. Read the EAQ before asking for help. Remember to provide the appropriate log(s).

2. Versions below 1.11 are no longer supported due to their age. Update to a modern version of Minecraft to receive support.

 

 

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