What does this means for Forge?

[American2050]

https://www.minecraft.net/en-us/article/minecraft-snapshot-19w36a

 

CHANGES IN 19W36A

• Obfuscation maps are now published with all future releases of the game

 

Quote

MODDING

In an effort to help make modding the game easier, we have decided to publish our game obfuscation maps with all future releases of the game, starting today. This means that anyone who is interested may deobfuscate the game and find their way around the code without needing to spend a few months figuring out what’s what. It is our hope that mod authors and mod framework authors use these files to augment their updating processes that they have today. These mappings will always be available, instantly and immediately as part of every newly released version. This does not, however, change the existing restrictions on what you may or may not do with our game code or assets. The links to the obfuscation mappings are included as part of the version manifest json, and may be automatically pulled for any given version.

I'm not sure what this exactly means, and what changes (if any) we would expect to see on Forge.

[LexManos]

We will be making an announcement about it when we can. The current state is that it means almost nothing for us. As the license doesn't allow for us to actually USE this information.

We are waiting to hear back from Mojang's legal team {This is all stuff they could of answered before the public announcement by asking us, but whatever}

 

Keep an eye on Github/Twitter and we'll keep you updated.

[ShinyAfro]

On 9/5/2019 at 2:23 PM, LexManos said:

We will be making an announcement about it when we can. The current state is that it means almost nothing for us. As the license doesn't allow for us to actually USE this information.

We are waiting to hear back from Mojang's legal team {This is all stuff they could of answered before the public announcement by asking us, but whatever}

 

Keep an eye on Github/Twitter and we'll keep you updated.

If you guys end up using these, won't MCP become irrelevant and allow you guys to automatically map per release?

Speeding up the development cycle like this, would you consider making snapshot builds? or would that still be too time consuming as the internal structures change?

Because if it was not too much work, this could mean forge would be released hours after an actual MC release. It would be a massive game changer.

 

APIs like fabric who try to gain an edge like this will perish.

 

I wonder what the implications are for  Spigot and SpongeForge?

[LexManos]

No, this will be irrelevant for the update cycle.

Forge, and other projects have had access to this information for years.

As I have stated many times, the concept that Forge is slow to update is a dirty lie spread by people who just want to disparage our good name.

1.13 is a SPECIAL CASE that took a while as a explicit decision. As we took the time to re-write the entire toolchain/codebase.

NORMAL updates take less then 24 hours to do. And we will be continuing that tradition now that our rewrite is finished.

 

MCP will still exist, as there are a lot of things that MCP allows us to have that these mappings do not.

Documentation, parameter names, better names, better code from injected data/managed data. 

This is NOT as useful as people are thinking. And with the legal issues it's actually detrimental to the community as a whole.

As the only people who benefit from this, are the ones who do not respect Mojang's copyright.

There already are projects that just straight up use the mappings, deobf/ship Mojang's named classfiles/decompiled code.

Those projects will get popular because there are members of this community who are not respectable.

There probably will be a major fanbase harassing everyone about using the names. 

 

But, Forge WILL respect Mojang's copyright, so as is we can't publicly use these names.

[ShinyAfro]

15 hours ago, LexManos said:

No, this will be irrelevant for the update cycle.

Forge, and other projects have had access to this information for years.

As I have stated many times, the concept that Forge is slow to update is a dirty lie spread by people who just want to disparage our good name.

1.13 is a SPECIAL CASE that took a while as a explicit decision. As we took the time to re-write the entire toolchain/codebase.

NORMAL updates take less then 24 hours to do. And we will be continuing that tradition now that our rewrite is finished.

 

MCP will still exist, as there are a lot of things that MCP allows us to have that these mappings do not.

Documentation, parameter names, better names, better code from injected data/managed data. 

This is NOT as useful as people are thinking. And with the legal issues it's actually detrimental to the community as a whole.

As the only people who benefit from this, are the ones who do not respect Mojang's copyright.

There already are projects that just straight up use the mappings, deobf/ship Mojang's named classfiles/decompiled code.

Those projects will get popular because there are members of this community who are not respectable.

There probably will be a major fanbase harassing everyone about using the names. 

 

But, Forge WILL respect Mojang's copyright, so as is we can't publicly use these names.

Can you not just use another map ontop of their map to create an near-instant auto-map, though?

The names would then be different, which idk much about legal, but would that not be something completely different?

Edited September 8, 2019 by ShinyAfro

[LexManos]

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Can you not just use another map ontop of their map to create an near-instant auto-map, though?

What? Our tools already do that, they match the names as best they can and then migrate our mappings.

This changes literally nothing in the SRG/MCP update process.

It just makes a big legal/community headake until the legalities are fleshed out by Mojang.

[ShinyAfro]

On 9/9/2019 at 3:05 AM, LexManos said:

What? Our tools already do that, they match the names as best they can and then migrate our mappings.

This changes literally nothing in the SRG/MCP update process.

It just makes a big legal/community headake until the legalities are fleshed out by Mojang.

Oh , so you guys already had the mappings, they are just releasing them to the public now?

[Stojke]

On 9/10/2019 at 2:45 PM, ShinyAfro said:

Oh , so you guys already had the mappings, they are just releasing them to the public now?

Yeah, they had the mappings but it was reversed engineered by Forge Team and not given by Mojang themselves. Hence they don't gain any help or advantage over anyone else since they already had it. You cant speed up something that's already going as fast as possible e.g they are already pushing updates as soon as they finish them which is in less than a day.

Edited September 15, 2019 by Stojke